Water pump, worth changing?

"Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell." (oppisitelock) 09/03/2015 at 06:01 • Filed to: None

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I’m about to book my car in for timing belt service. It’s 5 years old and has 38’000 miles and was wondering if it’s worth changing the water pump with the belt. Bear in mind the cost to do the pump is fairly significant compared to just doing the belts and tensioner. The timing belt will be redone in another 5 years (or 60k miles if it comes first) and will definitely have a water pump swap then if not now.

KirkyV > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 06:06

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If you don’t get it changed, and the pump fails later on, how much more will it cost to get it replaced than it would if you had it done at the same time as the belt? Working out whether it’s worth risking the extra money is ultimately the only way to decide.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > KirkyV 09/03/2015 at 06:08

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Very true. Well if it failed badly that’s goodbye to the engine most likely. If it started leaking it’s the cost of timing belt again to replace it.

AndyG_UK > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 06:09

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I always get the pump changed while the cam belt is being done, it's like 40 quid for a pump and they are in there already so it makes sense to change it at the same time.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > AndyG_UK 09/03/2015 at 06:10

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All told it’ll cost me £80 extra to get the pump done I think.

KirkyV > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 06:10

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Eh... Sounds like it might be worth it, to me, ‘specially if you’re planning to keep the car for a decent bit longer.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > KirkyV 09/03/2015 at 06:12

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I’m planning to keep the car indefinitely really so yeah I guess worth changing. Thinking about it if I start doing more mileage I could hit almost 100k on the original pump, which seems a lot.

Hiroku > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 06:14

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OEM pump plus labour? That price seems a bit on the expensive side for just the pump.

Anyway, I would definitely get it done along with the belt. Better safe than sorry with these things.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > Hiroku 09/03/2015 at 06:15

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It’s for pump and labour to change it on top of the rest of belt kit, this is only the first price I’ve got though, doing some phoning around before I book it in.

Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 06:32

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I’ve never preemptively changed a water pump. I just wait till it goes and then deal with it. But if it can take out the engine with it (which seems rather lame to me), it would probably make sense as a preventative maintenance item.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! 09/03/2015 at 06:33

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Yeah with it being an interference engine if the bearings failed, the timing belt would fail then all hell would break loose.

pip bip - choose Corrour > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 06:44

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i’d do it if it’s leaking , otherwise leave it.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > pip bip - choose Corrour 09/03/2015 at 06:47

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No leaks or anything like that. It’s still pretty newish.

Wobbles the Mind > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 07:06

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As someone who has driven an ‘06 Kia Rio from 17,000 miles to 257,000 I can tell you that the water pump is a “life of the vehicle” item in these small cars. Don’t worry about it until your third timing belt change or 180,000 miles.

Seriously, your vehicle is way too new for the water pump to be even a consideration. Doing the first belt change is a great idea though, mine snapped at 67,000 miles and I got lucky nothing was damaged considering it’s an interference engine.

pip bip - choose Corrour > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 07:13

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in that case leave it alone.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > Wobbles the Mind 09/03/2015 at 07:13

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So you kept your original pump until 180k? That’s interesting didn’t think they’d have that kind of longevity.

But yeah we've had an engine killing timing belt snap in the past so i'm pretty careful with them.

davedave1111 > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 07:32

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It’s a 50-50 proposition, normally. Chances are extremely low at that age that the water pump will be a problem in the life of the belt, but unless there’s something really weird about the Twingo it ought to be only an extra tenner plus parts on top of the timing belt change - and a water pump shouldn’t be more than thirty or forty quid. If you aren’t too bothered by an extra £50 then you might as well have it done and save yourself worrying about it - even if the worry’s unjustified.

On the other hand, unless there’s a problem with Twingo water pumps, there’s really almost zero chance of it failing at this age, and even if it goes it won’t grenade the engine. And even if it does break the engine, which is about as likely as finding a flux capacitor in Tesco, you can buy a replacement engine with fewer miles for about £250 and it’s not a massive amount of work to do a straight swap.

davedave1111 > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 07:34

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Well, that’s a very steep price as far as I know. On the plus side, though, you’ve found out one garage is willing to try a mild rip-off and can take it off your list.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > davedave1111 09/03/2015 at 07:46

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Well it’s a main dealer so I expected it to be honest. Waiting on a few quotes from good independent garages now.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > davedave1111 09/03/2015 at 07:49

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I’ll have to have a think about it. Money is rather tight at the moment (at the stage between uni and actually finding employment where I’m basically living off savings) so I’m tempted to leave the pump. I'll have to see what more reasonably priced garages charge to do the water pump too.

davedave1111 > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 07:59

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Oh right, yeah, main dealer prices are a rip-off to start with on a car like a Twingo. One of its big advantages is that repairs are cheap and easy. Paying main dealer prices for them defeats the object.

What was the main dealer quote for the belt, out of interest? I’d guess £400-500? If so you’ll be very pleasantly surprised when you find the local guy who’ll do it for £150ish all-in.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > davedave1111 09/03/2015 at 08:02

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The quote was £345 without pump and £425 with pump.

davedave1111 > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 08:04

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If money’s tight and you have free time, why don’t you do the work yourself? As long as you’re careful, it’s normally a pretty easy job.

McMike > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 08:05

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Get an estimate for the water pump replacement on it’s own.

The water pump (I’m assuming you have the 1.5.) is timing belt driven, and the belt needs to be taken off to do the waterpump.

I’m surprised that:

Your timing belt interval is so soon. How many miles/KM are on your car?

There are shops that don’t bundle it all together. Most shops that I know of won’t even give you a quote for a timing belt alone. It’s always belt/pump.

jariten1781 > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 08:08

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The car calls for a timing belt at 40k? That’s a bit nuts...haven’t seen that kind of interval since the 80s.

I usually prophylactically change the pump in the 60-100k range when I’m in for the belt. I would not do it at 40k...they have way more life than that (well, unless it’s a VAG 2.0T...but their pump isn’t under the belt cover). Get it next round, unless on inspection, it's leaking.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > jariten1781 09/03/2015 at 08:10

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Interval is 72k miles or 5 years, but most recommend you don’t pass 60k. I hit the 5 years first.

I’ll have it inspected and make a decision I suppose. I might decide to get it done either way.

davedave1111 > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 08:16

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Ouch. That’s about a quarter of what the car’s worth, isn’t it?

jariten1781 > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 08:29

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Ahh, makes more sense...wasn’t thinking about the time interval (I drive too much, haha). In that case, since you’ve hit the time interval, I’d go ahead and do the pump.

BigBlock440 > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 08:30

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It seems really soon for a water pump to fail. If you’re already planning on another belt change anyway, I’d just wait until the next one. Unless that water pump is really shitty, it’ll be fine. Realistically the worst case scenario is the pump starts failing somewhere between belt changes, at which point you’d just do your second belt change a little earlier than planned.

smobgirl > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 09:47

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On the flip side, I changed the water pump in my civic when I did the belts at 190,000 miles or so, and the pump was leaking by 205,000. There are two sides to outliers on a bell curve.

uofime-2 > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 09:55

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Does your engine have a reputation for breaking timing belts/tensioners/idlers/waterpumps?

If not, and you can crack the cover and verify that the belt is in good condition given that moneys a bit tight I’d probably just leave it alone.

Wobbles the Mind > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 09/03/2015 at 10:03

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It’s usually the belts will go long before the pump does. It’s recommended to replace at the same time as the timing belt because you can put the labor together, not because you actually need to replace it.

I’ll put it like this, when engines use a timing chain how often do you hear anyone mention changing the water pump, harmonic balancer, or any other hardware?